Better Rugby Rules

Rugby Fans are very pissed off, how the tweaking and fooking around with this great game has gone in the last 10 years.

First, just refresh your self with my foundation post ‘Chess vs Checkers’, a few quotes from there:

..”If rugby administrators break the rule ‘rugby is like chess’, they will have a hybrid game that is some where between checkers (union) and chess (league). A hybrid game will see rugby lose its hard won identity”..

..”Rugby union can be broken down into combinations: Front row, back row, loose forwards, back of scrum, centre field, back three. These combinations perform as units within the structured game of rugby, performing specialised roles, with specific skills and body shape. Fracturing the demand for a player with these specialised skills is a move away from the structured (chess) game and a move towards a more generic player (checkers). The generic player will be selected on his ability to multi task rather than perform a specialised role (ie15 loose forwards).”…

..”Forwards should be forwards, and backs should be backs”..

..”The honest intention to attract TV revenues from the temporary fan (those that watch rugby league, Australian rules, American football, and soccer) is commendable, but not at the expense of the ‘true rugby fan’. Rule changes and playing times suitable for TV viewing are not always in the best interest of the rugby fan, administrators must protect the base that got the game to from 1901 to 2008.”…

What others are saying…

Source: Rugby facing entertainment issues – Greg Ford

Some quotes..

It’s a sad indictment on the game, and a rather embarrassed looking Jerome Kaino knows it.

The big All Blacks flanker packed down for the Blues in their romp over the Cheetahs on Friday night. But for once his most loyal fans, his two sisters, didn’t go to the game. The reason? They’re sick of rugby. Tired of all the aimless kicking.

“They actually can’t wait for the league season to start,” Kaino said rather sheepishly.

“Rugby, they reckon, has become boring, so they can’t be bothered watching anymore. I was a bit surprised but when I thought about it, some of it hasn’t been flash, has it?”

The question, albeit rhetorical, deserves an answer, because this year, more than any, Kaino’s sisters are not alone.

And…

But more than ever there’s a growing school of thought that rugby is becoming its own worst enemy. That one of the game’s great strengths its complexity is leading to its demise. Nobody the players, coaches, referees and fans can understand what is going on half the time.

A high-ranking rugby official who shall remain nameless admitted recently: “It’s got so bad I have found myself flicking over to Rove on the Friday night because I can at least understand that.”

To add to the confusion, two different sets of laws are being trialled in the northern and southern hemispheres and there’s as much confusion about what path the game should take on the field as there is off it.

The International Rugby Board is keen to seize the initiative and avert further confusion by staging a potentially face-saving meeting at the end of this month.

The traditionally more conservative north has looked on disapprovingly while the south adopted short arm penalty sanctions for most offences in an attempt to speed up the game. The experiment has been a mixed bag. The north stridently disagrees, arguing rugby doesn’t necessarily have to be fast for it to be compelling.

COMMENTS:  I would watch rugby every week for 52 weeks a year, however this last weekend I watched ZERO games. My main issues are:

• Tight five’s in the back line
• Field wide defence
• Kick, kick, kick
• Scrum resets
• Too many short lineouts
• Super 14 2009 jersey fruit salad (NZ teams).
• Too many fatties who dont have the skill running with the ball (fatties have other important roles)
• Reduction of traditional micro rugby contests: Backs vs backs, tight five vs tight five, etc
• All the above is the result of the loss of ‘traditional rugby structure’ (see my post called Chess vs Checkers).

Source: Stats shows there’s still wow-power  – Duncan JohnStone

Mr JohnStone says that Super rugby has the WOW power because the stats say so :

• First 4 weeks have seen 131 tries, thus the game must be more open.
• 20 out of 27 games has seen the score difference btw the teams less than 13

He claims that because of these stats it’s not boring.

Thank god this guy is not your financial adviser as he would have sold you shares a year ago, and we all know how that turned out. Mr JohnStone get it through your head, the score or even the number of tries does not measure the true nature of a skillful rugby contest. Maybe he should get data for these statistical questions:

• 1 How many kicks per game, and quality of them ?
• 2 How many minutes are forwards standing in the back line  ?
• 3 How many minutes do props/hookers run with the ball compared to backs ?
• 4 How many occasions do you see a pure back line one on one contests ?
• 5 How many mauls (yes I like them)  ?
• 6 How many long and short lineouts  ?
• 7 How many scrums,  with/without resets ?
• 8 How many styles of rugby have been demonstrated ?
• 9 How many minutes the game is dominated with the field wide defence pattern ?

NOTE : Pre and post ELVS game stats should be studied.

Mr JohnStone you can have a game that ends 6-0, and it can be considered a great game. I can point you to a few games of the ABs vs Boks over the years. Lots of tries can be seen as ‘basketball’ rugby, a style that breaks down the multiple of rugby contests for more dotting down action. (Please read Foundation posts of this blog for more explanation, thanks.)

Mr JohnStone is a half arse hack, thinking that the rugby public can be tricked into believing that the ELVs are better than ‘cheese on toast’ with a few ‘not so deep’ stats. This guy should be running a bank in Wall Street as this type of spin is well sought after there!

UPDATE1: Source: ELVs face one final talkfest  – Marc Hinton

The International Rugby Board has one last chance to sell its controversial Experimental Law Variations at a global gathering in London at the end of this month as the May deadline looms.

The IRB will convene a conference of 70 key stakeholders in London when the ELVs, which have been largely decried in the north, will be given the fine-tooth comb treatment.

But with the decisive May vote looming for the IRB’s council and the vibe from the northern hemisphere largely negative on the law variations, even the IRB is admitting prospects aren’t exactly encouraging.

“They will be debated in much detail over two days,” said IRB chief executive of the London conference on the ELVs. “There will be presentations, we’ll look at videos of matches, all the stats and everyone will get the chance to look at all the ELVs and take their thoughts away and discuss them within their unions.

“What will happen, I don’t know,” shrugged Miller. “We were asked after the 2003 World Cup to look at areas of the game, and put the process in place and have extended trials which we’ve done.

COMMENTS:The NZ rugby commentators in print and on TV have been given a silent mandate to push one view of the ELVs and that’s ‘be in love with them’, otherwise your local NZRU wont talk to you any more. I recall only two dissenters in NZ, and one was Pat Lam, thats it. All the ex rugby players paid via SKY TV are not encourage to diss the sport as it turns off the punters (note: When I mean diss, I mean constructive discussion about the outside influences pissing off local rugby fan.) Looks like to me that ELVs will be watered down as the ‘money north’ just dont share the love of them.

Source: Two-pool idea looms as plan B  Tony Robson

Mr Tew on SANZAR future

“We’ve made it clear we respect their desires around the Currie Cup, but you are either in a joint venture or you’re not and you are prepared to make some compromises or you’re not.”

Source: ELVs make Super 14 a big turn-off: O’Sullivan – Greg – Growden

 Eddie O’Sullivan on the ELVs in Super 14.

Eddie O’Sullivan, one of international rugby’s leading coaches, has described the Super 14 as a dud and, due to the glut of free kicks, he can’t be bothered watching it.

O’Sullivan, Ireland’s most successful coach of the modern era and who recently took over as the United States head coach, admitted on an Australian rugby podcast last night that he had lost all interest in the Super 14.

“I’m not that taken by the whole thing,” he said. “I don’t agree with the law changes. The dynamics of the game I don’t like. It just doesn’t do anything for me.”

He said the experimental law variations had led to the decline in standard. “The law variations with the use of all the free kicks, I just don’t agree with. It makes the game different. It’s a hybrid game that is being played.” [Please read foundation posts: Chess vs Checkers]

My Comments: Looks like to me changes are a foot on all fronts.

Source: Bucket tipped on ELVs – Adrian Proszenko

FORMER Wallaby Dick Marks has delivered a damning 10-page critique of the experimental law variations to ARU supremo John O’Neill.

Marks, a Queensland Rugby Union board member, sent the document, titled The Other Side of the Coin, to O’Neill and fellow rugby heavy-hitters David Nucifora, Rod McCall, Peter Cosgrove and Peter McGrath, calling on them to review the way the ELVs have been implemented. He writes that the ELVs have:

■ Made referees a law unto themselves;

■ Turned rugby into a “kickfest”;

■ Increased the number of penalties and free kicks;

■ Almost eliminated “true” ruck and mall contests;

■ Not been universally accepted and not applied uniformly worldwide; and

■ Not enhanced rugby’s entertainment value.

Marks writes: “Sure, there are stats that say the ball is in play more, but that’s not much use when it’s 50 metres up in the air.”

And he has the backing of several influential identities, including former Wallaby Gary Pearse, kicking coach Ben Perkins and veteran Welsh official Malcolm Lewis.

“Most of the people that have publicly supported these laws are part of the extended ARU PR machine,” he wrote. “It’s useless getting comments from players who say the laws are wonderful. No player on $300,000 will get up and say, ‘I hate them’, they’ll be toeing the official ARU line … I want the other side of the coin presented to the public.”

My Comments:Think back to the ELV cheerleaders and the great central rugby union SPIN machine, those idoits love their paycheck more than they love the game. TV Commentators, radio jocks, tossers, thank god for free bloggers and some of the free press out there!

My Comments: Pulling down the maul and anything goes within lineout numbers are allowed. I hope these two are canned. The ruck and maul laws go back to last years laws, free kick will not be used as it was in the Super 14 2008.  These are the ELVs for the world wide trial starting the Aug 1st 2008. Honk Kong and beyond. In April next year the IRB will vote on these EVLs on a  rule by rule basis.

Source: http://www.irb.com/ELVs/

UPDATE1: Looks like there is a battle going to get SANZAR on the same ELV page.  Source : Boks keen to change ELVs

Source: ELVs just no good so let’s dump them– Evan Pegden

Southern hemisphere rugby has been sold a pup and it’s time to come clean and ADMIT IT !

The ELVs or at least the ones aimed at solving the perennial problems at the breakdown and speeding the game up are not working.

Yes, the ball is in play more but much of that time is spent watching it sail through the air in a glorified game of forceback the type we played as kids but never envisaged our elite players would turn into a yawn-inspiring art form.

Many of these experimental variations are worthy, such as the quick lineout throw that doesn’t have to be straight, the five metres that backlines have to be back from scrums, and the outlawing of kicking out on the full from within your own 22 if the ball is passed back to you from outside it.

But let’s face it, the free kick-fest that promised to speed the game up with lots of quick taps, while keeping the set pieces important by having lots of scrums when the quick opportunity is lost, is not quite working out the way we thought it would. Instead it has become a kick-fest of a different type.

It hasn’t solved the breakdown problems because it has just made the referee’s job even harder as he tries in a split second to make the correct ruling at the continuing pile-ups, conscious that the onus is on him to keep the game moving.

The result? Even more of a lottery when the individual differences in referees’ rulings are taken into account. Teams have quickly found it is not worth the risk of turnovers, which now happen so easily, or free kicks in their own half so they kick more.

Aerial ping-pong is the result, and the quality of the kicking has not generally been that good, although some are becoming adept at that exciting attacking option, the midfield bomb, with the best hope being a 50-50 chance of regaining possession,

My Comments: After reading an article in the NZ Herald quoting Pat Lam (Auckland Blues Coach) as he slammed some of the ELVs I had a feeling the NZ rugby press had finally woken up. The main reason why the ELVs pulled so much southern support from day one is that you have two desperate CEOS (Tew/O’Neill) wanting change in the hope that it would bring in more revenues. The crack in the NZ media started when Wayne Smith coined the phase ‘aerial ping-pong’, well that started the snow ball down the hill, media all over the rugby world are using this in there negative tone of the ELVs. There are 23 ELVs, 15 being used in Tri Nations, I think you will see about 4 surviving the trials (5 meter behind scrum, quick throw ins changes, no passing behind 22, corner post changes).  Up north Eddie Jones is a good barometer of their train of thought.

Source: Eddie Jones sticks to his guns

        This is what Jones had to say in his column in The Independent on Saturday:

“There are far fewer scrums. We had only five put-ins against Quins and went through the second period without a set piece called in our favour. Speaking as a former hooker, that really hurts.

“And the line-outs? We had 11 on our own throw. As recently as 2003-04, a team could expect the best part of 20 line-outs and at least a dozen scrums. This is a massive change that goes right to the heart of the way a game is plotted and played.

“Under these laws, teams are kicking more. We all thought it would happen, and so it has transpired. If the ball spends longer in the air, it spends less time in the hands.

“If there are fewer passing movements and fewer drives – even the basic pick-and-go routines around the fringes of the rucks look like becoming more scarce because of the way referees are controlling the breakdowns – there will be fewer knock-ons or “unplayable” calls at the tackle, and therefore fewer set pieces.

“Rugby is meant to be a sport for specialists, one for all shapes and sizes. This has always been, and remains, its mission statement – its guiding principle, if you like.

“What price specialists if we continue on this current path? Am I going to pick a prop who is really destructive in the tight but slow around the field if the number of scrums is way down in single figures?

“Ultimately, the answer will be no. Our scrum coach is Cobus Visagie, who also happens to be one of the best tight-head technicians in the game.

“The favourite one-liner at (Saracens) at the moment is: “Hey Cobus, what do you do for a living these days?” The last thing I want to see is these blokes disappear.”

And so say all of us.

My Comments: To be fair what Eddie Jones is seeing is the same trend that happened in Super 14 2008, teams start off playing too loose, then latter on in the season they realise that structure is required to break down field wide defences. So the season starts off with the mad hatter tap and go all the time, and will end with more scrums and lineouts near the business end. Well that’s how it happened downunder. In the end the generic ELV game will be a mirror of the Super 14 2008 final. So if you are a northern rugby coach get the inside oil of how to win an ELV game from this blog ! (ha).

All the downunder ELVs cheerleaders with their word in print on the internet, will look a little stupid soon. The TV commentators in NZ/AUS with their blind puppy love for the new world order of the ELVs will soon tone down there trumpet blowing and follow the more honest swing of mainstreet thinking that these ELVs in their current form must not survive. See my ELV amendments, thanks.

GOD SAVE RUGBY UNION !!!

Source: ELVs force both sides into safe approach – Mark – Geenty

Smith said it was ironic that the ELVs, designed to promote an attacking game, had evolved it into a form of aerial ping-pong.

“The ELVs have created the game where territory’s important where you don’t want to be caught too often behind your gain line or in your own territory. Someone’s going to get a free kick which could create momentum for the other team,” he said [Wayne Smith 2008-09-10].

My Comments: Does anything more need to be said, the ELVs in there current form cant not remain.

Source: Sour taste from half-pie ELVs – Greg Ford

IRB boss Mike Miller has admitted that, “in hindsight”, the global trial of the ELVs has been flawed.

A NZRU spokesman even confirmed no decision had been made on which rules will apply in next year’s Super 14.

Miller: “In hindsight we might have bitten off more than we could chew.

“We looked at a lot of areas in the game we thought we could improve. The trials were not universal in scope. They were trialled at senior level in some countries and not in others, which didn’t help.

…”Perhaps a more simple approach would have been better.”…

My Comments: This blog has seen the ELV faults from the beginning. Stupid ELV cheerleaders have done the game no good. I like the ELVs but with amendments,that has always been my case. Downunder has just learnt where the rugby power base is and that’s up North (England, Ireland and Wales).

Some of the not so bright cheerleaders are (drum roll):

1) CEO of the ARU John O’Neill can be blamed for a lot of the political waves the ELVs have caused. His ‘peacock‘ type stance has done the ELV case no good.

2) Paddy OBrien and the LPG Committee. The management of  the ELV trials did not have a popular following.

3) Rod MacQueen (back room influence) allowed too much of his Aussie rules and rugby league to influence the formation of some of the ELVs.

4) CEO NZRU Steve Tew for having blind puppy love for the ELVs, as staunch rugby man he should have known better.

5) All television rugby commentators that tried to tell the NZ rugby public that pulling down a maul and 8 vs 2 man lineouts was a good thing !

All the above need to read the founding post(s) of this blog

  Source: The British don’t understand rugby, and don’t understand the ELVs – Spiro Zavos

My Comments: I am not going to post the article here, but its typical of the claim and counter claim with no formula to target an end result, I mean the desired format for rugby union, a blueprint. This blog is about the balance between structured and non structured play in rugby union, to much of either is not the best for rugby union. You cant have endless running rugby because it becomes mindless, you cant remove the variety of structure from the game as it reduces specialised skills that took years to develop (mauls, full lineouts, etc), if you take time to read the foundation posts of the blog you will find a well thought out approach how rugby union should look like.

Spiro confirms that the only structure in the new ELV game that keeps the need for players to be all shapes and sizes is the scrum, pre ELVs, mauls, driving, full lineouts required more of the short fat stocky guy than post ELVs. Spiro will say, “Hey, those structures are still there!”, yes thats true but in a much reduced frequency.

The best running rugby is born after a rugby union structured platform, NOT from the horizontal lines of offence and defence, where one player just misses a tackle! Gee Spiro get that thru your head !

Dan Carter – Kicking game all important under ELVs

Source: All Blacks are ready to put the boot into the Springboks – Toby Robson

All the signs are pointing to a kick-fest at Newlands when the All Blacks take on the Springboks in a pivotal Tri-Nations match this weekend.

the All Blacks coaches have talked openly about the lesson they learned over the folly of running everything in the loss to Australia in Sydney .

Suddenly Richard Kahui’s superior kicking game means he has established himself on the right wing ahead of specialist Anthony Tuitavake.

The All Blacks too have devoted plenty of their training sessions to kicking and catching, specialist coach Mick Byrne an influential figure.

There was a time not long ago when such developments would draw moans.

Ironically such complaints were a big reason why the ELVs were introduced. The catch-cries became all-too familiar – too much kicking, too many lineouts, not enough running rugby.

“You don’t want to get caught at the breakdown too often in your own territory because you are likely to have a free kick against you and then you hand momentum to the other team

“Hence a lot of teams are kicking a lot more than they did in the past. You want to attack if there’s opportunity, but if not you want to put the pressure back on the other team.”

Smith reckons South Africa won the kicking contest in Dunedin and believes they will try again at Newlands.

My Comments: The force back game has got a major boost from the ELVs, what a bore! Endless up and unders, yeah thats fun ! These statements confirmed my previous entry of how every ELV game will look like in the future (see here: Super 14 Final : Birth of the generic ELV rugby style! )

I remind you of some quotes from this page : My ELV Amendments

Graham Henry [quote]…“We were worried about the amount of turnover ball we saw, teams were going backwards and forwards without any sort of structure. We didn’t see any territorial pressure and continuity.” …

Laurie Mains [quote] …”If the aim of these laws was to speed the game up then they’ve succeeded. But the real concern I have is rugby is looking more like league every year.”…

Ian McGeeChan [quote]..”My concern is that we will end up playing one type of game, that the variety and depth of options which the game has always had will be taken away,”…

 Are you seeing the TREND YET !

Source: Grey days for league as Sonny prepares to shine – John Connolly

Rugby league and rugby union used to be so different, they were black and white. Now there’s a real shade of grey.

Experimental Law Variations have been introduced in rugby to increase the enjoyment of the game, but no one fully recognised the ramifications of bringing them in. [Blog – WRONG – This blog did]

Rugby is now a far better spectacle – players are five metres back from the scrum, there are no more driving mauls [Blog – And that’s sad!], you can’t pass back into your own 22 then kick the ball out, and short-arm penalties have increased the amount of tap and runs.

The Bledisloe Cup Test in Sydney last week featured only 14 lineouts, making it a more appealing game to watch. But perhaps the biggest impact the laws will have is making it easier for rugby league players to make the jump across to rugby.

And for that reason I expect Sonny Bill Williams to be one of several marquee players to successfully make the switch.[Blog – And easier for ARU to pick and choose league players to cover the depth issues]

When Willie Carne came across from league to play for Queensland, he had no problem handling the technical side of rugby, but he did struggle with the lack of space.[Blog – Thats because of the forwards standing in the backline, thank the ELVs for that, more here ELVs – ‘The Field Wide Trench Defence’ or ‘FWTD’ ]

Rugby will still need players of certain body shapes and props that can scrummage [Blog – This is sad, what only for scrummaging, traditional skills of mauling and driving will be lost in future years]. I don’t believe we’ll get to the league situation where halfbacks play hooker and centres play in the second row. But the games are far closer together. From now on, all the league backs and the better back-rowers are fair game for rugby.[Blog – ARU so happy happy Yipee !]

My Comments: John Connolly was a former Wallaby coach and is close to the workings of the ARU. So John has officially, maybe not knowing exactly what he saying, said that the aussie lead ELV committee (strong Rod MacQueen influence) wanted a closer game to league that would obviously help the ARU tap the huge resources of players in the NRL to cover there own player depth problem. The north are only currently waking up to this ambush. I believe the ELVs will change the game, but not as far as ARU wants.

John correctly said that there are less lineouts are even fewer mauls, in otherwords less traditional rugby union structure. If you don’t have structure then you are playing a more dumbed down version of rugby, for a full explanation of my thoughts please read foundation posts (must read Chess vs Checkers) . I have said before I like the ELVs but with amendments, see my ELV amendments page for more.

John doesn’t realise that the ELVs (in there current form) maybe a sad day for rugby union, that’s because he is delighted at the prospect of seeing all those great talented ball players in the NRL playing for Queensland rugby union in the Super 14.

Yes last nights Eden Park, Auckland game was an excellent ELV game for the first 60 minutes, and there have been other good ELV games. But what would be so wrong if we had the odd maul and more full lineouts. WHAT’S WRONG WITH MAULS,  I LIKE THEM ! See my post here: ELVs – Endangered Species: Maul and Lineout .

Source: Brian Moore on ELV attack

Among all the reviews, reports and recriminations regarding the trial of the ELVs in the north ahead of next season, former England hooker and current solicitor/columnist Brian Moore’s voice has been shouting louder than most.

Here is Moore’s Daily Telegraph column in near-full form for the staunch defenders of the old game to sit back and enjoy!

“The laws are for ALL levels of the game. The view of Super 14 supporters and viewers is no more legitimate than that of any third XV player in London Division Two. It is now quite plain that only the views of those connected with games seen on television, and thus ‘in the shop window’, are being heard. Few unions have sought the views of all their constituents and even fewer have a mandate on the subject.

– Any ELV that threatens the unique tenet of rugby – that it is a game for all shapes and sizes – should not see the light of day [Blog: Agreed].

– I do not accept that there was, or is, overwhelming evidence that rugby needs fundamental changes to its laws. Nobody has ever identified the imperative which made this whole exercise necessary. [Blog: Do not agree, pre ELVs refs are too influential on the game outcome, and too many grey zones on how to ref the game, some change was required].

– ‘If laws do not move forwards, the game moves backwards’ – it’s a stupid cliche, disproved by many other sports whose laws have remained static without detriment [Blog: Agreed]. .

– I was and still am suspicious of the motives of certain countries that are pushing the ELVs, because I was at an International Rugby Board meeting at which it was stated that the moratorium in introducing any new laws had to be introduced because it became obvious that certain countries, Australia in particular, were suggesting law ‘improvements’ which would favour their international team’s strengths[Blog: It seams that way, maybe a bit harsh]. .

“Allowing mauls to be collapsed: I don’t think collapses will produce many more injuries, save for lifting a man off his feet, which is dangerous and should be carded immediately. I do think it removes the last method of ensuring opposition forwards are kept in, or close to, the breakdown and not clogging up the midfield. [Blog: Agreed]

“Not having to match the throwing team’s numbers in the line-out: This allows packing midfields with forwards and putting ‘flyers’ at the tail to exploit an advanced position. This could be solved by making any forward not in a line-out stand 10 metres back and within 15m of touch. [Blog: Na, just have full lineouts, otherwise this is one solution. Decision pending.]

“Handling in the ruck: They say this only legitimises what goes on anyway. It goes on only because referees allow it. Go back to the previous laws on rucking. [Blog: Agreed, 1970’s rucking style I hope he means !]

“Reducing all offences to a free-kick, save for offside, foul play and repeated or cynical offending: This has not led to the referee being less involved in games, the reverse is true. On average there are 50 per cent more times when the referee whistles. This is because players are prepared to take a risk on committing offences, knowing the referee has a difficult job deciding on their intention. Thus, referees are as much, if not more, involved in influencing the game. [Blog: Not sure, more data required, will watch games with this thought in mind. Interesting Watson ! ]

“This proposed change has contradictorily been claimed to both speed up the game and empower the scrum. Both cannot be true. Further, even if there are scrums chosen instead of a free-kick, scrums are not empowered because they are not a contest anyway due to the IRB allowing referees to ignore the stated put-in law. [Blog: The hooking contest has been a joke lately, so he has a point, that’s the refs failed policing of current law].

“Drawing an offside line immediately when a tackle takes place: It is a measure of the confusion caused by the ‘okey-cokey’-style trialling of the ELVs that we do not know if this still lurks or is dead. If not, kill it, it is stupid. [Blog: Interesting, jury’s out]

“The avowed intent and claimed consequence of the ELVs to ‘speed up the game’ is illegitimate. The 95 per cent of players to which the ELVs will apply do not need or want a ‘faster’ game, nor are they equipped to play one. [Blog: Dont agreed, players are equipped, the little fatties just lost a few pounds, thats all.]

“If you want to discourage aerial table tennis, extend the ‘mark’ rule to the 10m line of the opponents’ half. This would stop aimless punting, particularly the chip and chase when players can think of nothing else to do with possession. [Blog: The force back game is horrible, and seams more popular under the ELVs, this needs more thought!]

“Can I be any more candid?” [Blog: Nope Just fine!]

My Comments:Brian most likely represents the northern view from the grass roots level and up in the UK. You can bet that the ELVs as we know them down under will not be the final package. If they survive at all. Brian does make some good points concerning ELVs that remove traditional rugby union structure from the game. Others well, he is on the radio, and he must stir things up for the ratings so ‘grain of salt’ comes to mind. I like the ELVs but with amendments, see my page call My ELV Amendments, thanks.

 This is just a quick note to comment on the ELV’s in the above game.

 1) Did you notice the contrast in refereeing style between this game and the game the week before (ABs vs Boks), ELV’s can also be destroyed by the refs performance (I mean the poor performance of the Aussie ref in the AB game).

2) The first half was horrible. Kicking sequences of 4 to 6 kicks, yuk, the ELVs have a force back game within it and it’s a bore. The first half lacked traditional rugby union structure.

3) The field wide trench defense was prevalent through out the game, at times it looked like bull rush. (More here ELVs – ‘The Field Wide Trench Defence’ or ‘FWTD’ )

4) I don’t like the 6 vs 3 in the lineouts, it looks stupid, and it favors the defending side out wide. Why don’t they just line up horizontal offensive and defensive lines and run at each other. (More here ELVs – Endangered Species: Maul and Lineout )

5) If John O’Neill claims that this game as Rugby Union ELV spectacle then he needs his head examined.

6) The game got better in the second half as the Boks tired, the game had more traditional rugby union structure. Just as I said on this page My ELV Amendments  more needs to be done before a final ELV package is settled on.

…”30 years ago the laws imposed structure within rugby union, today the ELV laws allow the players to choose to scrum or not, to have a long lineout or not. I say allow players to choose to scrum or not, but inject some structure back into the game via the laws by allowing (b) (ie (b) is Full lineouts only). This re adjusts the balance between structure and non structure to equilibrium”…

 To conclude..

Finally, not all games are good, pre ELV games have had there bad day also, so balance in ones judgement is required. Read my blog because I have all the answers, ha !

Peacock Persona: ARU CEO John O’Neill, look at me, look at me, I am important ! 

Source: Players survey shows ELVs are the future– Duncan Johnstone

A survey conducted by the Australian, New Zealand and South African Rugby Union Players’ Associations has emphasised that players see real benefits from the ELVs that were played during this year’s Super 14.

The comprehensive survey involved 264 Super 14 players – 98 New Zealanders, 93 Australians, and 73 South African players.

The ELVs got a ringing endorsement with 90% of players saying they ere either very or relatively easy to interpret or understand.

My Comments: The Super 14 2008 ELVs have won approval by the southern players. That is the ELV package without pulling down the maul and lineout numbers (not the full 23 ELV changes proposed by IRB) . The northern clubs will find their 10 to 13 ELVs that they like, and then there will be some sort of horse trading between the two. I believe we (the world wide fan) will get a result, it just that CEO egos and bluffs are center stage at the moment.

That peacock ARU CEO John O’Neill should take a chill pill !

Then again some one has take the negative and the affirmative in any debate, let the ELV show roll on.

 Source: Split looms After North turn back on ELVs – Greg Gowden

The southern hemisphere is committed to retaining the ELVs, meaning Australia, New Zealand and South Africa will be playing a significantly different game to their northern counterparts.

“This leaves us in the southern hemisphere in a quandary, but more particularly leaves the IRB in a very difficult position,” O’Neill said. “They’re looking to have a universal game with one set of laws at the earliest opportunity. But it’s impossible to have consistent and common dialogue about the new laws unless we have all trialled them.”

O’Neill said he was sick and tired of the northern countries arguing the ELVs were a southern hemisphere plot, and that the European teams were being ambushed into using the laws.

“To the contrary, the IRB has promoted these laws to improve the game and the spectacle, but there is now the serious risk of two games, with two different sets of laws. It could happen,” he said.

“People in the north are saying, ‘You just want the game to look more like rugby league’. Do you reckon the last two All Blacks-Springboks Tests look like rugby league? They have got to be kidding.”

My Comments:  There wont be two sets of rules when the dust settles, if there was International rugby would die, and so would the sponsorship with it. The north have more money, so the south will eventually back down. John O’Neill will find out that his other SANZAR partners wont be standing side by side when the bayonet meet flesh of international rugby status. For now they will put on a brave face. This public spat shows more how ineffective the IRB are leading the game. Why couldn’t this spat be fought out in a board room is beyond me.

I am in favour of most ELVs, but not all. I bet the English like some of them too, but not all. The north is drawing a line in the sand to get a more ‘northern style ELV’ package to their liking. I guess this means: No pulling down the maul, no free-kicks for hand in the rucks, stuff like that.

John O’Neill brought this attention on the ARU and himself, he has been acting like a peacock with the ELVs, and his counterparts don’t like it. You change minds behind close doors John, not public out bursts. Maybe his second term as ARU CEO will be his last, thank god !

Negotiations are continuing, but with daggers and bayonets drawn !

It was always going to get down this, seriously the ‘boring old farts’ cant run anything.

UPDATE1:

Source: O’Neill comes under-fire from UK  – Neil Reid

But Welsh Rugby Union chairman David Pickering has rubbished comments that Wales was wavering over the ELVs.

However, he conceded his union had opted against trialling ALL the ELVs which had been initially proposed by the IRB.

“In Wales all 13 new ELVs approved by the IRB will be part of every game so that we can all clearly see how the new rules modernise and improve the spectacle of rugby for supporters and the enjoyment of all the players who take part,” Pickering said.

“The original 24 suggested new laws have been paired down to the 13 and there has been widespread agreement not to adopt the experimental sanctions which replaced penalties with free-kicks for some infringements.

“Here in Wales we agreed with the sentiment that the sanctions were a step too far.

The ELVs have now had two showings in the top-level international arena, with both All Black/Springboks Tri Nations clashes played under the experimental law.

The laws are set to be introduced to the UK on August 1.

My Comments:Like I said the north will have their ‘northern style ELVs package’, that suits them. In the end, all 23 ELVs may never be played in a professional game of rugby union at the same time, but there will be a ELVs in the game at the next RWC, just whose package will it be, my bet a package that represents the northern ELV selection. Those that have the gold, make the rules !

UPDATE2:

Source: O’Neill’s hectoring holds no sway in the north

Finally, nobody likes to be bullied, nor has much respect for someone who takes their bat home. If you want to go your own way, then go; see how far you get without the economic power of England and France. Our game will be the poorer without you, but we will always have one.

My Comments: In other words, ‘Go get Stuffed John!’

Source: Henry happy with new rule changes

Graham Henry has given the ELVs a pass mark after their international debut in the opening Tri Nations test at the weekend.

However, he said he is still not sure about the sacking of mauls and the open numbers in the lineout.

The All Blacks coach gave the thumbs up though he conceded that they make things harder for his coaching staff as they make the game less structured.

His players prefer playing to the new rules as the game becomes more open and more athletic.

But the All Blacks will have to wait and see whether all of them become permanent law within the game.

And All Blacks forwards coach Steve Hansen believes one of the new ELVs will not survive – the rule allowing sides to use any number of players in the lineout.

He said it is flawed and gives the defending team an advantage.

My Comments:This goes to show that no matter how many tests and trials completed by the IRB, those results mean squat when matched to ‘professional rugby’ trial results. The two new rules in the Tri Nations (maul sacking and lineout numbers) will be dumped from the ELV list I predict. Sorry there is just no love for them ! Done, gone !

Source: Wallabies maul controversial ELV  – Neil Reid

Wallabies forwards coach Michael Foley has spoken out about the risk of serious injury by the experimental law variation which allows defending sides to drag down attacking mauls.

Foley has spoken out following the death of wing Juan Cruz Migliore who died from a broken neck when a maul was collapsed in an Argentine club game last weekend.

While Sanzar did not trial the collapsed maul law in the limited ELVs it used in the Rebel Sport Super 14, the experimental law is permitted in the upcoming global trial of the ELVs.

Foley, a former test front-rower, said Migliore’s death highlighted the potential for danger in allowing mauls to be collapsed.

My Comments: Da, IRB what more do you need !

More here: ELVs – Endangered Species: Maul and Lineout

 John O’Neill

Source: Numbers game will bar code – Jacquelin Magnay

AUSTRALIAN Rugby Union boss John O’Neill has given a blunt warning that one of the football codes might not survive. He reckons it will come down to the survival of rugby union or rugby league, not both.

O’Neill said yesterday that league and union need to protect their own backyards as much as concentrate on interstate and overseas expansion because of the crowded marketplace and aggressive pursuit of new territories by the AFL and soccer.

” I mean, competition is about survival. Rugby league and rugby union actually are the two games that are very similar. Rugby league is celebrating 100 years of its existence. I’m not talking about reunification of the two games, but in this battle for hearts and minds, there is a risk that one of us may slip off the list.

“I don’t intend for it to be rugby union, I’m not intending for it to be rugby league. But I think we know there is a gorilla in the room called AFL and we know, I know, that football is the big mover and shaker – and therefore, I think rugby league and rugby union are going to have to fight very hard to maintain our positions, particularly in the eastern states.”

My Comments:  If you have ever wondered why the ARU is blindly supportive of ELV rugby, the above desperation comments from John O’Neill must seal it for you. I am not against the ELVs, I like them with changes (see my page called My ELV Amendments ). The ELVs is the ARUs great white hope for competing with NRL and ARL, and survival.

Source: Law variations threaten to cause chaos – S Jones

Despite fierce opposition, the IRB hopes this week to sneak changes through the back door that could have dire consequences for the game

THE WEEK ahead could prove one of the darkest in the history of the International Rugby Board, the ruling body of the game, and could harm rugby for generations. On Thursday, the IRB council meet to vote on an extraordinary proposal originating from their laws project group, a body many see as unrepresentative of the modern game, that a series of experimental laws, effectively including a bewildering 32 new or revised measures, be imposed on all rugby from August 1.

The measures have run into ferocious opposition in Europe. The English, Welsh and Irish unions confirmed on Friday that they remain implacably against blanket imposition of the Experimental Law Variations (ELVs), therefore joining all 12 of the Guinness Premiership coaches and all of the Top 14 French clubs.

Owen Doyle, the Irish spokesman on the ELV issue, effectively spoke for all the opposition: “The radical ELVs change the key characteristics and identity of rugby union and we are very concerned about them for that reason.” The laws would be imposed initially for a one-year period, but as one opponent said: “Once they are in, how do we claw the game back? The experiments become the status quo.”

In my experience, the reaction of the big European unions and their technical debate has been markedly more constructive than that of the IRB hawks. I have found not one IRB supporter of the ELVs who will admit that even one of the new measures is shaky or dangerous, that they will inevitably change the charter of the game by stealth and artificiality, or that to rush through untried laws could threaten the sport’s growing commercial power and cause chaos to the community game.

On this last front, the RFU launched a website (www.rfusurvey.co.uk) on which anyone can express their views. Some IRB grandees blithely dismiss any hint of a problem, but this abysmal failure to grasp the scale of confusion that faces the sport is possibly the most disturbing aspect of all. The idea that, during the holiday season, a torrent of new measures will cascade down to junior clubs and schools and players at all levels in 120 nations with the required clarity is ridiculous.

There is, apparently, some good news. The three main opposing unions (England, Wales and Ireland) hold two votes each and I understand that Italy also have major reservations. Each major union holds two votes and, as any radical motion needs a 75% majority, it should be possible for the unions opposing the ELVs to stop their imposition.

However, it may not be so simple. With the looming possibility that the IRB will fail to get the necessary majority, we have had reports of serious pressure and horse trading, aimed at the smaller rugby countries.

IRB tacticians have spotted two possible ways to get the trial through by the back door. They could ask the council to propose that the ELVs are merely imposed on the professional game, hoping to attract support from countries whose chief gripe is the community chaos and therefore betraying one of the game’s oldest tenets – one set of laws for everyone. Or they could force a debate on each individual ELV, voting as to whether each could have a trial.

I have seen a document giving the reaction of all six of the major European unions to each ELV. Even with the tame acceptance of France and Scotland to every measure, there is barely one radical ELV which gets a majority in favour. However, with different nations objecting to different experiments, it may just be possible that most of the laws are pushed through one by one. The opposing unions are alive to this. “We have told our delegates not to vote for anything until they see what the whole picture is,” one chief executive told me.

Of course, none of this is even to begin a discussion of how appalling has been the fate of other laws down the years forced onto the game. Nor has the IRB managed to persuade supporters, given the scale of support for the measures in the southern hemisphere, that this is not another attempt to speed up artificially the pace of the game.

The IRB insist that scrummaging will still be a staple when it is obvious that, with the tap-and-go style seen in the southern hemisphere under the ELVs of late, coaches will rapidly opt for smaller and faster players.

Yesterday, members of the laws project group denied to journalists that there was panic over their bid to get the laws ratified. Yet all they achieved in their presentation was to create an even thicker fog around the whole issue. A well-meaning trawl through the key ELVs produced not one that stands up to their claim that the laws are working excitingly well.

After three years of effort, it seemed a poor return. It also seemed to me that those who have allowed the project to become their lives are afraid to admit that it is too big and that it does not work. As I said last week, they must be stopped.

My Comments: Just another opinion, must review all rugby thought out there, be fair !

Stephen Jones has been rugby correspondent of The Sunday Times for more than 20 years and is regarded as one of the sport’s most influential commentators.

Source: Stephen Jones debates the biggest issues in rugby union

On Inside Rugby in Australia a few weeks ago, George Smith said half the players like the ELVs and half don’t. A very diplomatic answer but hardly “relatively positive feedback”. There is no real evidence that the players prefer them. JD, Brisbane, Australia

SJ: Every player in Britain I have heard offering an opinion is against the ELVs, even the few that are going to be trialled. There is a great political correctness around now under which everyone is the Southern Hemisphere is frowned upon if they dare to suggest the new laws are not brilliant.

I  am a PE teacher in a west London co-ed school with 1,500 pupils. I have been at the school for eight years and have produced some good, if a little rough around the edges, rugby players who have gone on to play for local senior teams in the Twickenham and Richmond area. However, I cannot and will not continue to coach youth rugby if the law to permit the collapsing of the maul is allowed to go ahead. To do so would be in breach of my “loco parentis” with the pupils in my care. Should an accident occur, or I should say when an accident occurs, it will be me as the teacher and then my school who would be in line for legal proceedings against us. I cannot believe that the IRB are serious in this as a means to improve the game. The maul has been a core element of the game since its inception and should remain so. If other countries (Australia in particular) are struggling to find decent forwards then they should look at the state of their own game instead of trying to run roughshod over ours. The state of the game in the Northern Hemisphere has never been healthier and doesn’t need tampering with. My advice to the IRB and the RFU is to leave well alone before they lose the youth and community rugby that they spent millions on previously trying to improve. Chris Salter, PE teacher at Lampton School, Hounslow

SJ: Well said Chris. And that goes for the scores of people who have written to me who echo your thoughts on the place of the maul in the game, especially the coaches and teachers who feel the same sense of duty. As we now know, the RFU has bravely decided that enough is enough and will not allow the maul experiment in under-19 rugby. Long may Lampton rugby thrive.

When I was young it was perfectly legal to collapse a maul. The powers that be then came along and said “do this no more for it is very dangerous”. The reason given was that the number of maul-related injuries was increasing each season. Fitness levels were not as they are now, nor were the mauling techniques as sophisticated. The IRB will now be liable to litigation under duty of care as it can be shown that they are reversing a law that was introduced to reduce the known risk of injury. So how can the new law be defended? Peter Brown, Bridgend

SJ: Agreed Peter.

FAINT PRAISE FOR THE IRB

Partly hidden away last week was the first sign of a climb-down by the International Rugby Board that they are finally acknowledging the sheer power of the opposition to the grisly ELVs.

It’s about time. Every report suggests that political correctness is now so rampant in the Southern Hemisphere that it is simply not done to express yourself in opposition – although as George Smith of Australia said in the New Zealand Herald recently, only around half the players believe that the experiments are any good.

In Britain, from top to bottom and at any level, from coaches of junior rugby all the way up to the top players and top coaches, the opposition is total and so is the sense of dismay that just a fraction of the full raft of experiments have sneaked their way in to the next European season.

However, there is good news. Last week, the IRB issued a directive to referees. It asked them to remember the laws. It insisted, for example, that referees are hard on players in rucks and at the breakdown, that players on the team in possession are refereed strictly, so that they do not simply flop over the ball to seal it off.

In other words, the IRB have belatedly realised that one of the major problems in the game is that their own laws are being ignored by their own referees. This is new. Speaking on the record to me only six weeks ago, Paddy O’Brien, the IRB referees manager, was clearly posing to me only a rhetorical question when he asked if I wanted the laws to be refereed strictly. “I can tell you that it will cause two years of chaos if we suddenly go back to the letter of the law at the breakdown,” he told me.

That is exactly what the IRB are now going to do, and they are completely correct. You see, their only other strategy to try to avoid the mess at the breakdown was an ELV cheats’ charter in which they basically abandoned almost all of the laws and sanctions, and set loose an utterly nonsensical tap-and-go fiesta of rubbish in which almost every offence was liable only to a free kick.

If they are really good enough and strong enough to apply the existing laws at the breakdown, we will see the re-emergence of the ruck, we will see the game speeding up, we will see the end of that horrible succession of mini-rucks through which teams run down the clock.

And we will see the end of the need for ELVs – as if there was any question in the first place that they were unnecessary. At last, we can give full marks to the IRB.

My Comments: I am not a great fan of Jones, but his opinion was 100% correct about the All Blacks prior to RWC 2007, and we didn’t listen. So let him have his voice.

Source: Tri-Nations ELVs confirmed

“We’ll be playing under the Super 14 ELVs plus the two that the IRB approved: unlimited numbers in the lineout and pulling down the maul”..

And we can see these laws applied four times against (ABs vs) Australia, woopee wont that be fun (not) !

Please read this post for my view:  ELVs – Endangered Species: Maul and Lineout 

Source: (Peter) Thorburn slams trial of maul law changes

There is strong disapproval for one of the new Experimental Law Variations in place for this year’s Tri-Nations.

The International Rugby Board has agreed to a year long trial by SANZAR to allow the pulling down of a maul.

Former All Blacks selector Peter Thorburn says the change is a step backwards. He says the whole point of the maul is to allow players to group their defence and make a choice whether they want to join in or not. He says this is a short-sighted decision to allow players to pull the maul down.

Despite Thorburn’s comments, Wallabies coach Robbie Deans has backed the new changes.

             Crusaders win!

Yes I can honestly say this was one of the better ELV rugby games in the Super 14 season. But what did Robbie Deans work out at the beginning of the season that the other Super 14 coaches did not.

1) ELV rugby laws allows play to be very loose (non structured): Using free kicks solely for tap and go (add to this short lineouts) allows a game to have very little traditional rugby union structure. I believe Robbie new that having scrums and long lineouts (with the odd maul) allowed a better platform for attacking rugby. The final had more than average scrums, long lineouts and mauls. This is why the final was a better representation of rugby union that earlier Super 14 games. Also Robbie doesn’t need to be a rocket scientist to realise that the field wide defensive line is removed while executing a scrum or full lineout.

2) The kick and chase game is now critical to acquire territory: Kicking to find a defensive player out of position, up and unders landing outside the defenders 22, kicks that find middle ground and bounce causing defenders to take time to respond. The game of force back is more prevalent under the ELV rugby. To have a smart kicking game you need smart kickers, this means all players numbered 9 to 15 must have an eye for the tactical kick. Just having a smart kicker at first five or fullback is not enough. The aim is to execute running rugby in the opposition half, the Waratahs on occasion broke this rule.

3) Player type selection: Selecting a tight five for solely tight forward duties is over. Brad Thorn is the new tight forward mold, he must be loose and tight when the circumstance requires it (Yes you guessed it, ARU can now go shopping for forwards in the NRL). I guess while scrums still require pushing the only true tight forward is the tight head prop. Mobile, tall and very athletic tight forwards are the prescription. A game for all shapes and sizes, not any more!

3) Fast ball beats defense: This is not just true for ELV rugby, but the execution of fast and accurate passing finally allowed the Crusaders wings to get some space (on one occasion it lead to the try of the game) to run around their opposition.

4) Fitness: Yes having the puff and pace to go the distance, this was very evident in the last 20 minutes of Super 14 final. The side that lacks fitness is slower to set up an attacking back line, slower to run onto the ball, slower to cover the field in defense and more likely to drop a tackle.  The Waratahs were dead in the water in the second half.

Why should I be worried about the state of rugby union when the Super 14 final was confirmed by all as such a good game.

Firstly, there was only 13 out of 23 ELVs applied in the 2008 Super 14 season, yet to be used laws around the maul and lineout allow for more traditional rugby union structure to be removed from the game (see Foundation posts for more discussion). 

Secondly, answer this question:  Is the above style likely to be adopted in every ELV rugby game?  Yes if you want to win! Rugby union may be entering one style of play, the Crusaders way!  I am afraid when ever I watch NRL or AFL all I see is the same generic game every weak, if the players wore the same colors each weeks I wouldn’t know if different teams were playing. Rugby union should not be getting design concepts from NRL or AFL. It would seam otherwise !

The rugby union styles of England, France and South Africa may be morphed into the Crusaders ELV rugby style and the winning of the game will just come down to who executes this style better than the other. This will lead rugby union to be boring and indifferent!

Ian McGeehcan has a point when he said ..”“My concern is that we will end up playing one type of game, that the variety and depth of options which the game has always had will be taken away”… HERE

A quote before you leave:

..”They say that death kills you, but death doesn’t kill you. Boredom and indifference kill you.”.. By Iggy Pop 

This quote highlights that rugby union greatest sin is to be boring and indifferent.

       Adam Thomson

Source: Henry sends rejection message – Steve Deane

Masoe seemed to be the unluckiest discard, with Hansen saying the versatile flanker had been a casualty of the new experimental laws, which required a different type of player.

That could see a high value being placed on mobile loose forwards with lineout ability, which might explain the recent interest in the athletic, 1.98m Thomson, whom Henry said “wouldn’t have even been mentioned” if the squad had been picked before the Super 14.

MY COMMENTS: Doesn’t Adam Thomson look very much like an AFL player, fast, good balls skills, excellent in broken play, maybe not so great in the mud and tight forward play, but who cares, when is that ever going to happen in ELV rugby!  If the All Black selectors have already recognised that ‘all shapes and sizes’ has been redefined as the game is for ‘fast mobile tall’ players, I can see props getting thinner and taller. Maybe one day they wont need to push (ha) ! More evidence that traditional rugby union structure has been reduced within the game. (see Foundation posts for more).

Source: The ELV debate is a sideshow distracting us from more important questions – Chris S

More points does not mean a more exciting game. Rules that create more points will not necessarily make it more compelling.The biggest global sport by far is soccer – this game commands huge revenues and crowds, but does so with very low scores. (Perhaps an average goal count of 2 per match.) Points do not make games more exciting, in fact it seems that the opposite can be true – it is tension, suspense and occasional flashes of brilliances that win our hearts and have us coming back to watch again. Do we dare try some alternative ELVs that make points harder to score? [My Comments: My point excactly, see my ELV Amendments, this Aussie has got it right !]